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mobilejoe
05-15-2012, 10:41 PM
I have a 1987 d21 with a z24I motor
I found a 1983 200sx intake which will bolt to my head (round ports)
The injectors that i got are bad So i need new ones what I need to know is:

what fuels injectors/rail can I run on this intake?
What computer would you recommend?
My local junk yard has a 95 200sx (untouched and all there) with a 1.6 can I use that computer,wire harness,mass air flow sensor,throttle body, and misc sensors?

Ideas,help pleaseeeeeeeeeee

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11627

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11628

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11629

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11631

mobilejoe
05-15-2012, 10:43 PM
this is a side by side of the two intakes
http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11630

StephenSimmons
05-15-2012, 11:37 PM
Do you know if the ka24e dizzy can be modified to fit the z24?

mobilejoe
05-15-2012, 11:50 PM
sorry i don't know

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 12:01 AM
sorry i don't know

Check and see. If so you can use the ka stuff along witt that intake

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 01:37 AM
not a bad idea
But the ka is 4 plugs
the z24i is 8 plugs
but the z24i has a crank angle sensor so maybe it would work???

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 01:44 AM
what fuel injectors would work?? anybody??

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 02:02 AM
not a bad idea
But the ka is 4 plugs
the z24i is 8 plugs
but the z24i has a crank angle sensor so maybe it would work???

When i did it on a ford 2.3 i only used the plugs on the exhaust side for fire. As for the crank angle sensor on the z24 im not sure of. What does the ka use to fire the dizzy? Is it all in the dizzy or does it use a crank or cam sensor?

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 02:05 AM
the D-21 with the Z24i was available from 86.5 till '90. Look for two wing nuts holding the air filter on over the TBI (which has two injectors) but with a single cover over them. All Z24i had 8 plugs, only the '80 200sx with the Z20E had the 4 plug head. The distributor is really a CAS (crank angle sensor)

With this CAS you can convert a KA EFI system over to work on any Z24 motor

this is a link

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/18348-wtb-2x-865-90-d21-z24i-distributors-8-plug-dizzy-hardbody-pickup/page__p__254592__hl__+200sx%20+fuel%20+injector__f romsearch__1#entry254592

I still need fuel injector info?

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 02:06 AM
what fuel injectors would work?? anybody??

The 240 injectors should work or whatever injector goes with the ecu and mass air your going to use.

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 02:14 AM
the D-21 with the Z24i was available from 86.5 till '90. Look for two wing nuts holding the air filter on over the TBI (which has two injectors) but with a single cover over them. All Z24i had 8 plugs, only the '80 200sx with the Z20E had the 4 plug head. The distributor is really a CAS (crank angle sensor)

With this CAS you can convert a KA EFI system over to work on any Z24 motor

this is a link

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/18348-wtb-2x-865-90-d21-z24i-distributors-8-plug-dizzy-hardbody-pickup/page__p__254592__hl__+200sx%20+fuel%20+injector__f romsearch__1#entry254592

I still need fuel injector info?

For a stock motor i would say 240cc injectors. If your converting the ka over to the z then use the ka injectors. You may have to modify the intake and fuel rail for them to fit.

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 02:29 AM
how would i mount them?
The stock 83 injectors are different
http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11635

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11634

I looked at a ka24 fuel rail and it would not bolt up to the intake

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1989-1990-Nissan-240sx-s13-fuel-rail-injectors-and-pressure-regulator-for-KA24E-/130664557187?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item1e6c36ea83&vxp=mtr
Am I just overlooking something

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 02:35 AM
stephensimmons you have a z24 motor as well ?
There are time when I think it would be easier to swap to a ka24 motor BUT I like being the "different" one and besides my motor is good.

thanks for all your help/ideas

:thumb::nana1::woot::nana2:

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 02:50 AM
All 4 cylender nissans dizzy's share the same style "encoder wheel". Which means it may be possible, I haven't tried to mod the ka one with the sr one though, just a thought in my head at this point. This would make it much eaiser to get the SR coil packs working. If Doug would sell me an intake mani I could try it.. http://community.ratsun.net/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif

I don't think the air fuel would be that far off. Think about what the ecu it looking for. Air volume, air temp, engine temp, throttle posistion. And rpm. Nothing about displacment. Plus in open loop the ecu tries its best to keep the fuel mixture optimal.


this came from here:
http://community.ratsun.net/topic/2165-project-ghetto-efi/page__hl__%2B200sx+%2Bfuel+%2Binjector__fromsearch __1

This is about the 4th time i have read that the ecu does care about the engine displacement
My local junk yard has a 1.6 (untouched) but no ka24 stuff (they just got done crushing cars)

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 10:58 AM
All 4 cylender nissans dizzy's share the same style "encoder wheel". Which means it may be possible, I haven't tried to mod the ka one with the sr one though, just a thought in my head at this point. This would make it much eaiser to get the SR coil packs working. If Doug would sell me an intake mani I could try it.. http://community.ratsun.net/public/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif

I don't think the air fuel would be that far off. Think about what the ecu it looking for. Air volume, air temp, engine temp, throttle posistion. And rpm. Nothing about displacment. Plus in open loop the ecu tries its best to keep the fuel mixture optimal.


this came from here:
http://community.ratsun.net/topic/2165-project-ghetto-efi/page__hl__%2B200sx+%2Bfuel+%2Binjector__fromsearch __1

This is about the 4th time i have read that the ecu does care about the engine displacement
My local junk yard has a 1.6 (untouched) but no ka24 stuff (they just got done crushing cars)

Well i do know i have pulled a chevy "4.3" out of a truck an put a 5.7 in it and used the complete 4.3 throttle body system on the 5.7 an just pluged the 5.7 dizzy in and had no issues.

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 11:07 AM
stephensimmons you have a z24 motor as well ?
There are time when I think it would be easier to swap to a ka24 motor BUT I like being the "different" one and besides my motor is good.
:o

thanks for all your help/ideas

:thumb::nana1::woot::nana2:

Yes sir i sure do. Im rebuiding it now. .030, shaved head, webcamshaft, header, port/polish, modified timing gear, stock fuel injection with a apexi-safc, and 2 1/2 exhaust. And a few other things.

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 11:25 AM
So here is my thought:

Go study the 200sx fsm and the d21 ka24e fsm

Maybe i can use all the 1.6 stuff and wire to a ka24e computer and use my z24i dizzy with the crank angle sensor.

That would leave figuring out the injectors
Thats the thought for the day

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 03:37 PM
ok making great progress!!!!!!!!
Found fuel injectors and spacers/bolts from a 280z motor
Found a ecu from a 92 ka24e truck
As far as wiring goes no ones got a complete harness so I found the plugs and stuff so i can use my harness and add just add a few wires and that will be done
I need a throttle body or can I use the 1.6 version??
I have to work the next two/three weeks so work will be slow but I will be doing some more research and will update as I go on.

But as all ways I'm open to help and ideas

StephenSimmons
05-16-2012, 04:02 PM
ok making great progress!!!!!!!!
Found fuel injectors and spacers/bolts from a 280z motor
Found a ecu from a 92 ka24e truck
As far as wiring goes no ones got a complete harness so I found the plugs and stuff so i can use my harness and add just add a few wires and that will be done
I need a throttle body or can I use the 1.6 version??
I have to work the next two/three weeks so work will be slow but I will be doing some more research and will update as I go on.

But as all ways I'm open to help and ideas

Look into the ford 2.3 from the 89-98 rangers. They had dual plug heads with dual coil packs and crank or cam sensors. The crank sensors were from 89-94 and the cam sensor were from 95 up

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 08:37 PM
I send way to much time at the junk yard !!!!!!!!!
They got a 1996 nissan altima in with a 2.4 liter motor

so I know have the 2.4 mass air flow and throttle body.
Had to change the cable brackets Part 1.6 and 2.4 parts but it works.

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11642old bracket

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11643new bracket

now on to sensors and ordering gaskets

mobilejoe
05-16-2012, 11:34 PM
which of these systems can I get rid of:

bpt valve
air inducton valve
a.i.v control
egr system (i know this can go) or would I get better gas mileage with it?
s.c.r control


I know I need a air temp sensor (will mount in air box) and a idle air valve of some sort I have no hook ups in the throttle body but I'll deal with it later.

Also the junk yard has a z22 block that i can have (needs rebuilt)
Can I use the z24 stuff (pistons,rods,etc) to rebuild it?? Future project

mobilejoe
05-17-2012, 11:52 PM
Anybody can tell me about the blocks ??

StephenSimmons
05-18-2012, 03:23 AM
Anybody can tell me about the blocks ??


read this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Z_engine

mobilejoe
05-18-2012, 09:17 AM
Late Z22E (1/82-2/83 200sx)
bore 87mm, stroke 92.0mm
(stroke/2)+connecting rod+ piston pin height = 227.6 mm
piston deck height: +0.15 mm (above block)

Z24 ('83-'86? 720 pickup)
bore 89mm, stroke 96.0mm
(stroke/2)+connecting rod+ piston pin height = 247.0mm
piston deck height: -0.45 below deck (using 34.0mm pin height pistons)

Fedral Mogul Z24 piston pn 13013P has pin height of 33.8mm, and unspecified "recessed head w/4 valve reliefs





this come from:
http://newprotest.org/projects/510/jasonGray.pl

read the section about Frankenstein motors

StephenSimmons
05-18-2012, 01:54 PM
Late Z22E (1/82-2/83 200sx)
bore 87mm, stroke 92.0mm
(stroke/2)+connecting rod+ piston pin height = 227.6 mm
piston deck height: +0.15 mm (above block)

Z24 ('83-'86? 720 pickup)
bore 89mm, stroke 96.0mm
(stroke/2)+connecting rod+ piston pin height = 247.0mm
piston deck height: -0.45 below deck (using 34.0mm pin height pistons)

Fedral Mogul Z24 piston pn 13013P has pin height of 33.8mm, and unspecified "recessed head w/4 valve reliefs





this come from:
http://newprotest.org/projects/510/jasonGray.pl

read the section about Frankenstein motors




Read through this link. kind of found it interesting that the ka24e head is a direct bolt on so it said!

http://forums.nicoclub.com/z24-block-flat-top-pistons-stock-ka24e-top-end-is-it-possible-t154889.html

mobilejoe
05-18-2012, 09:29 PM
Hum Makes one think

mobilejoe
05-18-2012, 10:13 PM
I was going though the fsm and found a 1992 stanza
and was wondering what you thought about using the computer (instead of the truck)
pros
ka24e motor
fan controller built in (major plus)

cons:
4 plugs instead of 8 (might work will need to look into it)
??????
any body else have some ideas

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 03:56 AM
Can some one tell me if a ka24e 4 spark plug computer can run 8 spark plugs (like on a z24)

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 11:21 AM
I guess that NOBODY cares or knows. If it ain't a ka24e then good luck

Right!!

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 11:40 AM
Can some one tell me if a ka24e 4 spark plug computer can run 8 spark plugs (like on a z24)

Im going going to say yes. I know it could be done. Let me think on it for a min and i could figuer out how to.

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 11:46 AM
I guess that NOBODY cares or knows. If it ain't a ka24e then good luck

Right!!

Wouldnt say they dont care its just that it's easier to swap than to figure out. The z24 is just like the honda A20 in the 86-89 nonda accords. NOBODY likes them because of the way thay are. BUT there is a site that makes that engine do what it do performance wise just like the 2.3 in the 84-98 rangers. It just takes one persons drive and determination to make a difference.

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 12:06 PM
Stephen you have been great, but my point is there should be others. And yes it would be simpler to swap over to a ka24e. But my z24 is still going strong and should it die then I will rebuild a napz Frankenstein motor.

So please don't take my hiss fit personally I just can't believe it just you and me with z24 motors

I have been though the fsm's for several cars and found the 92 stanza computer is wired the same as a truck (same plug as 90+), The only difference is pin 9+10 are blank in the truck/ the car is for fans. So it would seem that is a person was to swap to the stanza computer and add the pins (from donor) to 9+10 then wire up relays,fan,etc. Then you would have a stock setup. I have a aftermarket setup and it is a pain in the as?

Just a thought

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 12:15 PM
Stephen you have been great, but my point is there should be others. And yes it would be simpler to swap over to a ka24e. But my z24 is still going strong and should it die then I will rebuild a napz Frankenstein motor.

So please don't take my hiss fit personally I just can't believe it just you and me with z24 motors

I have been though the fsm's for several cars and found the 92 stanza computer is wired the same as a truck (same plug as 90+), The only difference is pin 9+10 are blank in the truck/ the car is for fans. So it would seem that is a person was to swap to the stanza computer and add the pins (from donor) to 9+10 then wire up relays,fan,etc. Then you would have a stock setup. I have a aftermarket setup and it is a pain in the as?

Just a thought

That would definetly work then. Sounds like when you swap a speed density mustang over to mass air. All you have to do is swap a couple of pin's and add a couple of wires.

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 12:20 PM
some nice reading!

http://www.sdsefi.com/features/oct00datsun.htm

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 12:31 PM
some nice reading!

http://www.sdsefi.com/features/oct00datsun.htm

Nice! If i was going to multi-port i would retro fit the ford 2.3 obdII system for eas of tuning.

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 12:44 PM
My local junk yard does not have a 2.3, he crushed it !!
Do you know where i could download the wiring diagram for the 2.3 ford?
I might know where a mustang is!

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 12:48 PM
My local junk yard does not have a 2.3, he crushed it !!
Do you know where i could download the wiring diagram for the 2.3 ford?
I might know where a mustang is!

If from a mustang i think it would have to be a 92-93 to have the 8 plug set up.

Check here for a diagram

http://turborangerforums.com/showthread.php?t=512

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 12:51 PM
yep it's a 8 plug 4 cly motor It has a bad tranny (he still drives it)
I think he what 650.00 for it with a clean title

StephenSimmons
05-19-2012, 01:11 PM
yep it's a 8 plug 4 cly motor It has a bad tranny (he still drives it)
I think he what 650.00 for it with a clean title

Those motors are damn near indestructible just like the z24

alabama_lowlife
05-19-2012, 02:15 PM
I guess that NOBODY cares or knows. If it ain't a ka24e then good luck

Right!!
Well, that's not far from the truth lol. I'm just trying to figure out WHY. Seems like an exercise in futility to me, like trying to reinvent the wheel. There are tons of solutions for using an internal combustion engine to propel a vehicle, many of which are already completed and don't require that you attempt to piece together something that might not ever work. When you're trying to do something unorthodox, you should expect that you're gonna have to figure out a lot of stuff on your own. Don't be offended that we don't care, it just seems like a colossal waste of time to me.

mobilejoe
05-19-2012, 06:49 PM
To you it might be a waste of time
To me It's the first steps towards the final goal.
So for me I want a napz motor with mpfi and a turbo (long term goal) but as things break on my truck then yes I want to upgrade and work towards final goals

And I understand that most will not care but alot of this is the same whether it's z24 or ka24 stuff The sensors,computer, i'm using are ka24 My truck is a hardbody
so yes the info should be the same

I will keep posting and maybe the next "nut" that wants to run a napz motor will have more info to go buy

mobilejoe
05-21-2012, 04:23 PM
Found a 92 stanza ecu and a idle air control form a vw jetta Also ordered all the gaskets will be in on Thursday.

Will post more latter

mobilejoe
05-27-2012, 11:08 AM
ok guys I have started this project and here is a photo.
So far so good It would seem my exhaust manifold has several cracks. So time to go to local junk yard. Also any ideas as to what to use for a air tube from the throttle body to the air box on the drivers side (I'm using a stock pathfinder air box)

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11692

mobilejoe
05-27-2012, 11:10 AM
also I found the valve cover from a 83 200sx. Bolts right up

mobilejoe
05-27-2012, 11:30 AM
Well, that's not far from the truth lol. I'm just trying to figure out WHY. Seems like an exercise in futility to me, like trying to reinvent the wheel. There are tons of solutions for using an internal combustion engine to propel a vehicle, many of which are already completed and don't require that you attempt to piece together something that might not ever work. When you're trying to do something unorthodox, you should expect that you're gonna have to figure out a lot of stuff on your own. Don't be offended that we don't care, it just seems like a colossal waste of time to me.


I get what your saying But it's like doing a intake swap on the ka24 motor.
When this is finished it should be easier to work on (less crap) should run better, My truck was just barley running. I found a 1/2 of fuel in the intake when I removed the throttle body. So thank you for your option

mobilejoe
05-27-2012, 06:08 PM
http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11695


vw idle air controller Talk about a nice simple way of dealing with it

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11694

ready for wiring!!!!

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11693

pathfinder airbox with alitma mass air meter

1989D21
05-27-2012, 06:24 PM
I too, have a Z24i, but I would like to do a V8 swap in the future. I think what you have done is cool so far and I will follow your progress. Sorry, but I won't be any help to you as I know nothing of parts interchangeability. Good job and good luck!

mobilejoe
05-27-2012, 06:46 PM
Thanks 1989d21
I will be starting the wiring on monday so I'll post more then

mobilejoe
05-29-2012, 12:03 AM
Hit my first major hiccup! I found several wires that were chewed (by mice I guess) and some that were green. So I had to pull out way more then I wanted. Oh yea I'm going to have to build a motor harness and then tie it back in to the good half of the truck harness :eek: or ???????????

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11711

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11710

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11712

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11713

StephenSimmons
05-29-2012, 12:43 AM
Get Er DONE! You knew you had to build a engine harness anyway, UNLESS you have the harness to go with the ECU you are going to use? I hope you have it complete also. If so you dont have too much to worry about.

mobilejoe
05-29-2012, 01:25 AM
just bits and pieces I was going to add to my harness so now I have to found a good donor harness

mobilejoe
05-29-2012, 01:53 AM
does any one have a fsm for a 1995 200sx??

mobilejoe
05-31-2012, 10:51 PM
Found a new harness so I'm back on track to get this done

AVMT
05-31-2012, 11:13 PM
Wrong Manual

AVMT
05-31-2012, 11:14 PM
Here is a good link for alot of Nissan Service Manuals.

http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 11:27 AM
thanks

I got to tell you all what a pain finding this harness!!
One of my local junk yards had two harness but both were cut, no problem I could take two and make one good one. So I asked how much. 40.00 for both. No problem I pulled both harness and walked to the counter and was told that he misquoted the price and he wanted 100.00 for each!! After lots of talking he came done to 70.00 for both and I said no and I walked away!! There's 3 hours that I'll never get back. (also I was banned from there)
So yesterday the other local junk yard called and said he has a buddy that had the harness. So I went for a 20 minute drive, And there it was a untouched 92 d21 wrecked on the right side. I was told that they had never sold a harness before, "it just was to much work" but if I wanted to pull it I could have it.
Yea me The best part is the wiring harness is for a ka24e motor so it's all ready setup for mpfi. So now I just need to extend some wires and change the fuel injector plugs and figure out the coils and should be good to go.

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 11:56 AM
does any one if a ka24e exhaust manifold will work on a z24 motor??
mines cracked in 3 places.

StephenSimmons
06-01-2012, 12:03 PM
does any one if a ka24e exhaust manifold will work on a z24 motor??
mines cracked in 3 places.

Yes it will bolt up but the ports dont quite match up. You shoult be able to port it to match though.

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 02:00 PM
question: where temp sensor (for the computer) goes the hole is to big, I don't have the room for a adapter. Can I use a temp sensor from a ford? it does screw into the hole. I know that the plug would have to be changed but that's easy.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Standard-Motor-Products-TX61-Coolant-Temp-Sensor-FORD-/330504533509?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Model%3ACrown+Victoria&hash=item4cf39af605&vxp=mtr

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 03:33 PM
also the harness that I have is from a 1992 d21 manual ka24e truck
I can only found the the throttle postion sensor plug not the throttle open/closed plug does it not need it?

yankabilly
06-01-2012, 04:43 PM
i have thought about this a bunch ... if i was going to do it i would use as much of the ka stuff as i could ( injectors , sensor wiring harness and ecu) it should all work with a little finesse...... i have some experince with this type of swap . i drive an 88 prelude si (obd0) with and 98 h22a4 (obd2) that runs on an chipped p28 (obd1) and it works with no cel
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/538212_487696607923062_2079484679_n.jpg
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/381015_372226619470062_473211687_n.jpg
i know its not nissan but i just wanted to show some of my work so you will know i'm not just guessing at it ....

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 05:25 PM
for the most part it is ka24 stuff. The intake had to be from a z22 motor,

ka24 stuff
wire harness
throttle body
mass air sensor
computer
z24 stuff
temp sensors
hoses
z22 stuff
intake
injectors (ka24 would not fit)
fuel pressure regulator

idle air valve is from a vw the ka24 would not work

does any one have a clue as to way this 92 harness only has one plug for the throttle sensor ?? There does not seem to be any plug /wire for the throttle open/closed sensor

:crazy::crazy::crazy:

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 05:38 PM
i'm looking for the plug for this:
Can someone with a ka24 motor look and tell if it comes from the same harness as the fuel injectors ..or.. does it come from the harness under the intake

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11726

I have this one:

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11727


thanks

yankabilly
06-01-2012, 05:44 PM
i just went out to look at my truck (93 ka) it only has a throttle pos sensor and thats it . do you want a pic of the intake ? my motor is out on a stand so any pic you need i can get

yankabilly
06-01-2012, 05:45 PM
thats it

mobilejoe
06-01-2012, 08:17 PM
ok thank you that makes me feel better

mobilejoe
06-04-2012, 01:28 AM
nice honda by the way

mobilejoe
06-04-2012, 01:31 AM
this is what I did this weekend:
before

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1574&pictureid=11742

after:

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1574&pictureid=11743


took down a total of 6 trees and part of the neighbors fence :rofl::rofl2::rofl:

that will be next weekends project

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 12:35 PM
quick update it's almost ready to fire need to find a exhaust manifold.

StephenSimmons
06-06-2012, 01:32 PM
quick update it's almost ready to fire need to find a exhaust manifold.

A new manifold is like $100. You can get a header for $50 more.

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 05:01 PM
Quick question:
I'm trying to get the fuel injectors to fire. BUT they won't. i am getting fuel to them, i have tried reversing the wires, even tried two computers. what the hel! my I doing wrong here!?.

StephenSimmons
06-06-2012, 05:28 PM
Quick question:
I'm trying to get the fuel injectors to fire. BUT they won't. i am getting fuel to them, i have tried reversing the wires, even tried two computers. what the hel! my I doing wrong here!?.

Ground?

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 05:45 PM
will go check

changed all relays/fuses just because and no change

StephenSimmons
06-06-2012, 06:03 PM
will go check

changed all relays/fuses just because and no change

Yea I have learned with these things that just because you have power means nothing without a ground.

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 06:18 PM
i'm i not wrong here but does the computer supply 12+ to the injectors right?

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 06:21 PM
no i'm wrong 12+ is common and the ground is from the computer

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 06:46 PM
ok if a hookup the injectors to a battery I can fire them

if i hookup the injectors into the harness i get 12+ on both wires!
if i unhook the injectors I get 12+ on the one wire only.
and i get no signal out of the computer at all with or without the injectors hookup

mobilejoe
06-06-2012, 09:13 PM
I went to the junk yard and got a 3rd computer plugged it in without the injector and I still do not have the injector signal coming from the computer so that means that i am overlooking something. any ideas/help

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 01:13 AM
I went out and hooked up a nissan alitima ka24e injector and it fires so the 280 injectors will not work.

now what?????

i need a top feed injector that will work with this setup.
any ideas?????????????????????????????

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1566&pictureid=11771

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 01:29 AM
also does any one know if the ka24 injectors are low or high impedance?

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 01:39 AM
there high impedance (saturated no r box)...what ecu are you using ? use an injectors out of an obd1 (92-94) integra (240cc top feed and saturted)

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 02:05 AM
i have an extra r box if you wanted to run low impedance injectors

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 02:47 AM
i have 280z injectors which are low impedance and i'm using a 95 truck ka24e computer which is high impedance

what's a r box ?

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 02:54 AM
r box = resistor box

what is it out of, would it be better to run the r box or the integra injector

thanks so much for your help

sicnis
06-07-2012, 03:31 AM
good luck with your swap joe, the next one will be easier haha
sorry i cant help either, im bodyman not mechanic :p

StephenSimmons
06-07-2012, 03:43 AM
r box = resistor box

what is it out of, would it be better to run the r box or the integra injector

thanks so much for your help

The resistor box is out of the early honda/acuras.

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 04:51 AM
The resistor box is out of the early honda/acuras.


yes thats right

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 04:54 AM
r box = resistor box

what is it out of, would it be better to run the r box or the integra injector

thanks so much for your help

i would try to find the teg injectors they will plug up... adding an r box means that you would have to wire it in to your harness..:(

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 04:57 AM
i have 280z injectors which are low impedance and i'm using a 95 truck ka24e computer which is high impedance


if you do this too long it will burn out the injector driver in the ecu :(

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 11:25 AM
not a problem the 280 injectors will not fire so there out and I will go and look for the new injectors

I'm so close to getting this done!!!!!!
Hopefully there's not to many more "problems"

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 11:41 AM
here's a calculator for fuel injectors makes things easier

http://injectorrx.com/sizing.html

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 01:54 PM
the fuel injectors that fit my intake have a short nipple on top, the hose clamp just fits and i mean the width. It might be fine but I don't feel real comfortable running it that way.

so i found a r box from a Mitsubishi
my question is,
what if i mounted the r box under the seat next to the computer. then cut the 12+ wire going to the injectors and tie in there using one wire out. that way I don't have to run new wires,etc nice and easy
or
mount under the hood and wire it using all 4 wires out to the injectors

what's your thoughts

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 03:08 PM
yea me I got four injectors firing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

thanks for the help on this one
I guess i'll wire the r box under the hood
getting closer to zoom zoom time

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 05:41 PM
ok it's running sort of????

it will idle (roughly) for about 30 seconds then turn off
if you give it gas it turns off
ideas?

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 06:24 PM
I found the problem I mis-wired the mass air meter

mobilejoe
06-07-2012, 06:27 PM
:nana2:it runs it runs it runs

needs some more work but

it runs it runs it runs!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2:: nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2:


in case you did not know IT RUNS

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 11:30 PM
hell ya we need a video

yankabilly
06-07-2012, 11:42 PM
i want to know how it pulls.... it should pull better then a carb z motor...now i want to build an z22 top end with a z24 bottom end and mpfi for my truck .... i'm going to start collecting parts now...
please post a parts list

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 12:57 AM
:nana2:it runs it runs it runs

needs some more work but

it runs it runs it runs!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2:: nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2::nana2:


in case you did not know IT RUNS


LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Good! Now build some harnesses and sit back and wait!

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 11:32 AM
I have not driven it yet. I still have to work out the idle bug and put the inside back together

here is a link to used parts finder:
http://www.mypartshop.com/default.aspx

look for a 83 200sx intake that's the hard part to find

i'll do a parts list for you
but first it's pic time
http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11778

r-box plug wired in

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11779

r-box mounted

http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1573&pictureid=11780

completed wiring for fuel injectors

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 11:45 AM
the wire harness is the easy part of this swap
start with a ka24 harness (complete from the cab to the front bumper) if you have a manual get a manual harness or if you have a auto get a auto harness.
you will have to:
extend the mass air meter, air temp sensor, tps,computer water temp sensor wires
change the fuel injector plugs (i used plug ins from a inline 6 cly ford motor)
add the r-box into the harness cut into you engine harness (carefully :D) find the white wire going to injectors that is 12+ cut it that goes to the power on the r-box.
now remove the rest of the white wire going to the injectors and run four new wires from the r-box to the injectors and done.
you have to add the r-box if you use the 280z injectors. and seeing that they mount in this is the cheaper and easier way.
i think the 83 200 injectors are the same just have to see if they are low or high impedance but i think they are low and need the r-box

more to come later

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 01:46 PM
I wish you all were closer i'm ready to hit my head on the brick wall!!!!1

When I hookup the vacuum line going to the brake booster it will not run If i leave the line open (leaking vacuum) it runs

It idles like crap
I run the codes and got the following
maf
iat sensor my fault did not have it hooked up
water temp sensor yes i'm the nissan one
i'll run out and get a mass from the jy when I can

ideas

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 04:08 PM
got a mass air flow sensor and that did not change anything
i do have a few ideas
fuel injectors maybe clogged?

also nissan has a r-box and it's nice
one wire in
one wire out

i found one in a altima i guess sentra, 280, 200sx ect ect have them
i'll stay with the Mitsubishi one seeing it's wired in

http://www.ebay.com/itm/R32-Nissan-Skyline-RB20DET-Injector-Resistor-Pack-/170695860614?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item27be442186&vxp=mtr

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 05:47 PM
I wish you all were closer i'm ready to hit my head on the brick wall!!!!1

When I hookup the vacuum line going to the brake booster it will not run If i leave the line open (leaking vacuum) it runs

It idles like crap
I run the codes and got the following
maf
iat sensor my fault did not have it hooked up
water temp sensor yes i'm the nissan one
i'll run out and get a mass from the jy when I can

ideas

Sounds like its getting too much fuel. Thats why it will run with that vaccume line unhooked.

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 06:00 PM
would that also cause it to run rough??
but it does start right up with the vacuum hose unhooked but it will not start at all with the vacuum line hooked up
also the mass air was not the problem nor was the computer temp sensor

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 06:11 PM
here's the sceps on the 280 injectors

Resistance: 2.7 Ohms
Flow: 270cc/min (28.8lbs) open
23lbs/hr 80% duty cycle
1975-78 280Z (L28E)
1979-83 280ZX (L28E)
1977-84 810, Maxima (L24E)
1984-86 300ZX (VG30E)
1985-86 Maxima (VG30E)

the ka24 injectors

FUEL INJECTOR SPECIFICATIONS:
Side-Feed OE Red Top
Flow Rate : 270ccmin at 3 BAR - 80% Duty Cycle
Coil Resistance: 11.2-11.5 OHMS
Viton o-rings

they both are 270cc

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 06:11 PM
would that also cause it to run rough??
but it does start right up with the vacuum hose unhooked but it will not start at all with the vacuum line hooked up
also the mass air was not the problem nor was the computer temp sensor

Yes it would. How about your O2 sensor?

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 06:15 PM
o2 sensor is the single wire and new I also tried a old one

would a bad injector cause this? one that is not spraying right?

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 06:19 PM
o2 sensor is the single wire and new I also tried a old one

would a bad injector cause this? one that is not spraying right?

Its possible. What is your fuel pressure set at?

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 06:28 PM
i'm using a new one for the 83 200sx and I can't find the pressure settings for it.

maybe it's time for a unversial?
if I go that route then what should it be set at

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 06:40 PM
i'm using a new one for the 83 200sx and I can't find the pressure settings for it.

maybe it's time for a unversial?
if I go that route then what should it be set at

Around 36psi. Do you have the vaccum line hooked up to the fuel pressure regulator on the intake?

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 07:16 PM
i hooked up a fuel pressure reg from the 2.4 altima and now it will start for a second then shut off does not madder if vacuum is on or off

yes sir on the vacuum to regulator

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 08:31 PM
here is what I have done so far:

pull the injectors and all four do fire.
tried two mass air flow meters
tried 2 fuel pressure regulators stock ka24e and 200sx 1983
I have spark on both sides I have tried with just the one side and on both


the system:

4) 280/200 injectors 270cc
ka24e mass air meter
92 stanza computer (ka24e)
92 d21 ka24e harness
95 altima throttle body (ka24de)

the vacuum ports are
brake booster
fuel regulator
pcv valve

problem:
won't run
if I remove the vacuum hose (leave it open) it will run but like crap

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 09:55 PM
i had a thought it's a long shot but i'll try sat.
what if the throttle body is wrong? I grab one from a geo storm it's smaller flap but it does have the idle air stuff built in so we will see.

but please any and all ideas are welcomed

thanks guys

StephenSimmons
06-08-2012, 11:33 PM
here is what I have done so far:

pull the injectors and all four do fire.
tried two mass air flow meters
tried 2 fuel pressure regulators stock ka24e and 200sx 1983
I have spark on both sides I have tried with just the one side and on both


the system:

4) 280/200 injectors 270cc
ka24e mass air meter
92 stanza computer (ka24e)
92 d21 ka24e harness
95 altima throttle body (ka24de)

the vacuum ports are
brake booster
fuel regulator
pcv valve

problem:
won't run
if I remove the vacuum hose (leave it open) it will run but like crap

You need to get the mass air meter that was on whatever you got that computer out of. It is never good to mix and match computers and mass air meters UNLESS you have a way to tune.

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 11:45 PM
it is from a altima with a ka24
i can not get the stanza one it's been sold
but the stanza had a ka24

mobilejoe
06-08-2012, 11:51 PM
does any one know what the tps wiring is

the gm one is
tps signal
ground from ecm
+5 volts from ecm

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 01:15 AM
i think the nissan tps is

1) 5+
2) signal
3)ground

is this right?

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 11:47 AM
I looked up the numbers on the maf and they do cross to a 92 stanza so it should be ok ?!?!? (:confused:)

here's what i'm thinking maybe the problems in the throttle body or the idle air system I found the geo storm one
The big downsized is it's smaller inside but for testing it should be fine
The big upside is:
1)one bolt hole needs enlarged by 1/8 then it bolts right on
2)it has the idle air system built in
3)it was free

The only other things I can think of are:
1)recheck all my wiring
2) fuel pressure regulator I know I have tried two stock ones but maybe this setup needs a weird pressure?
3) fuel injectors but they are all firing and working nicely and are the same 270 cc

if you think I am missing something then please post it
that's the plan for the day

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 11:50 AM
http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1562&pictureid=11784


http://www.infamousnissan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1562&pictureid=11785

if you look at the back you will see that the idle air setup is in the circle
most have there own channels we will see

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 01:31 PM
FOUND IT

one injector was bad it would fire but as soon as I swapped it out the really rough running was gone But it would not idle! So I swapped the throttle bodies and it idles around 900 rpms It's a little rough but that's probably The leaking fuel hose and the leaking exhaust manifold I do have a new one on order it should be here tuesday.

But it starts right up before 2 or 3 turns now 1 or 2 turns
I can't drive it yet to much temp hookups but now to make it all final.

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 06:05 PM
here's info on the regulator
http://www.sdsefi.com/techfpr.htm

the rough idle is back but I was able to drive it it needs work something is not right close but not yet

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 07:57 PM
i think it's the exhaust manifold the gaskets are leaking, and there is several cracks in it one is right at the o2 sensor so the new will be here late tuesday it's running rich but i think it's the leaks!

also I got to drive it quick throttle responds quick starts the idle air system seems to work so I think this is going to be ok.

should I do a full write on this?

Static808
06-09-2012, 09:28 PM
yes do it! that would be awsome!

mobilejoe
06-09-2012, 10:06 PM
ok will do i'll start a new thread for the how to

Segundo
06-10-2012, 08:51 AM
Goodluck i hope you get this done!!! I too have a Z24 and i wish i could help out but im a noob to all this!!

mobilejoe
06-10-2012, 05:20 PM
Had a thought why not try the mass air from the z24i !!!!!!!!!!!


I'll let you all know

mobilejoe
06-11-2012, 11:04 PM
Yea it's not running super rich anymore!!
the problem was a mismatched maf
But I got one that adjustable (old style)
if you need it richer or leaner it cane be done
in fact if i was to add a turbo I could dial it in

mobilejoe
06-14-2012, 10:17 PM
No matter what i do this thing runs super rich!!!!!!!!

I have tested every thing I even tried a complete matched 240 setup
No change it all ways runs rich

I am not a dumb person I have studied the fsm but no matter what it all ways runs rich. I worked at this problem for a week now, I have had others look as will.
The best we can come up with is I don't know..
I think it's time for a new motor or something else
I have never had problems like this before and this truck will be very very lucky if it stays out of the crusher.

Thanks to the very few that tried to help..